Element Double charge

Hi everyone,

We use Element for CC processing.  In the last couple of months, we've had complaints about 3 or so double charges. These charges are not represented in Tessitura, so I typically confirm by logging into Element merchant site and searching by card, date and amount, where there are in fact two charges.

I can credit the transaction via our merchant account with Element.  I've been told by Element customer service that they have seen this behavior before, but I'm wondering if we can do anything on our end to either find out earlier or stop this entirely.  Has it happened for anyone else?

(Forgive double post from Finance forum)

Thanks,

Frannie 

  • Do you use Element as the processor, or as a gateway? We’ve typically seen this happen (and not often, fortunately) if there’s an interruption (website or computer crash) once the card is authorized but before the order is complete. This is a result of our payment processor (FirstData Nashville), who mark a transaction as complete as soon as it’s authorized. So the transaction goes through to the bank, but because of the interruption, is canceled in Tessitura. Then if the patron tries again and is successful, there will be two charges, but only one order in Tessitura. We haven’t found a way to keep that from happening, but as I said, fortunately, it doesn’t happen often.

     

     

    Jeanne DeVore | Technology Manager
    Chicago Shakespeare Theater

    312. 667.4943 direct line  | 312.403.0314 mobile www.chicagoshakes.com | facebook | twitter
    800 East Grand Avenue on Navy Pier | Chicago, Illinois 60611

     

     

     

    From: Tessitura Technical Forum [mailto:forums-technical@tessituranetwork.com] On Behalf Of Frances O'Connell
    Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2015 1:42 PM
    To: Jeanne DeVore
    Subject: [Tessitura Technical Forum] Element Double charge

     

    Hi everyone,

    We use Element for CC processing.  In the last couple of months, we've had complaints about 3 or so double charges. These charges are not represented in Tessitura, so I typically confirm by logging into Element merchant site and searching by card, date and amount, where there are in fact two charges.

    I can credit the transaction via our merchant account with Element.  I've been told by Element customer service that they have seen this behavior before, but I'm wondering if we can do anything on our end to either find out earlier or stop this entirely.  Has it happened for anyone else?

    (Forgive double post from Finance forum)

    Thanks,

    Frannie 




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  • Former Member
    Former Member $organization
    Hi Frances,

    Yes, this happens to us too via the web merchant and also with internal processing. It's rare, though, only a few transactions per month. 

    TASK suspected that zip formatting at checkout online could've caused some errors - in the transactions that failed, the zip was 60045-3462 and in the one that completed was 600453462. CC_ZIPCODE in T_CC SERVER_LOG is only a varchar 10 which is why the first attempts do not work, throw a truncation error and nothing is written to T_CC_SERVER_LOG. Our web developers are reviewing this now - the site should be coded to strip out formatting when billing addresses are submitted. 

    Might be worth it to check your web code, although that only explains the web merchant issues.

    Thanks,
    Mary


    On Tue, May 5, 2015 at 1:41 PM, Frances O'Connell <bounce-francesoconnell1133@tessituranetwork.com> wrote:

    Hi everyone,

    We use Element for CC processing.  In the last couple of months, we've had complaints about 3 or so double charges. These charges are not represented in Tessitura, so I typically confirm by logging into Element merchant site and searching by card, date and amount, where there are in fact two charges.

    I can credit the transaction via our merchant account with Element.  I've been told by Element customer service that they have seen this behavior before, but I'm wondering if we can do anything on our end to either find out earlier or stop this entirely.  Has it happened for anyone else?

    (Forgive double post from Finance forum)

    Thanks,

    Frannie 



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    Tessitura Administrator
    Lyric Opera of Chicago
    312-827-5607

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  • Hi All:
    We are also seeing intermittent double charges that do not show up in Tessitura, but do show up in Element.  We have experience the same thing with unrelated credits.

    Though it is only intermittent, the behavior seems to have begun only a couple of months ago.  It is time consuming for our staff to track down and do what they can to correct the issues.

    I'm curious to hear just how widespread this might be...  Any others?

    Kindly,

    Mark

  • Glad to hear it's not just me! We've had I think 4 in the last year that I am aware of. Though, I would not be surprised if it's more and no one has caught it.  And we similarly don't have a great way of tracking them 

  • Hi all,

    Yes, this has been happening to us on a regular basis since we went live with v12. We've had a lot of dialog with Tessitura support on this one. To make a long story short... We experience this primarily when someone authorizes a card in a ticket order, but then does other things - like adding a CSI - before pressing Done to complete the order.

    Our current theory is defect 3931, which is resolved in v12.5, will help minimize this for us. 3931 resolves an issue causing Tessitura to crash when adding CSIs. But, we don't know for sure whether that bug is the only factor.

    Here are some tips based on what we have learned along the way:

    1.     Encourage staff who process orders to press Done immediately after authorizing a credit card (or as soon as possible after doing so). If other actions are needed, like adding a CSI, just use Load Last Order after pressing Done and then do the CSI. By doing this, you minimize the chance of a crash in between CC authorization and completing the order.

    2.     Make regular use of the Incomplete Credit Card Transactions report. This is a standard report and it essentially queries the t_cc_server_log table to identify potential 'orphaned' credit card charges. I believe our ticketing staff runs it daily now, and it allows us to resolve these issues sometimes before the patron notices.

    3.     As much as possible, try to encourage those processing orders to document specifically (step-by-step) what happened if a crash occurs. The more information that can be collected, the higher the chance Tessitura will be able to replicate some of the issues causing the client to crash. Of course, that's often easier said than done, particularly when things are busy.

    I hope that is helpful. I too am thankful to hear we are not alone in this!

    Thanks,
    David

     

    From: Tessitura Technical Forum [mailto:forums-technical@tessituranetwork.com] On Behalf Of Frances O'Connell
    Sent: Wednesday, May 6, 2015 3:48 PM
    To: David Frederick
    Subject: Re: [Tessitura Technical Forum] Element Double charge

     

    Glad to hear it's not just me! We've had I think 4 in the last year that I am aware of. Though, I would not be surprised if it's more and no one has caught it.  And we similarly don't have a great way of tracking them 

    From: Mark Sackett <bounce-marksackett2712@tessituranetwork.com>
    Sent: 5/6/2015 2:56:19 PM

    Hi All:
    We are also seeing intermittent double charges that do not show up in Tessitura, but do show up in Element.  We have experience the same thing with unrelated credits.

    Though it is only intermittent, the behavior seems to have begun only a couple of months ago.  It is time consuming for our staff to track down and do what they can to correct the issues.

    I'm curious to hear just how widespread this might be...  Any others?

    Kindly,

    Mark




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  • Unknown said:
    Our current theory is defect 3931, which is resolved in v12.5, will help minimize this for us. 3931 resolves an issue causing Tessitura to crash when adding CSIs. But, we don't know for sure whether that bug is the only factor.

    We've encountered the double charge issue occasionally since switching to Element in 2013, and have also encountered the above CSI-related bug, or one like it. Very interesting to read about this.

    I made a custom report for our accounting staff to run against data we download daily (see TASK solution #32) which among other things reveals charges that have no corresponding Tessitura payment record. These crop up less often these days than they did earlier in our v12 life, but still need to be watched out for.

  • Hi Chris,

    Our Finance department is interested in this sort of report. I can't find it in TASK for some reason - it's solution #32 in the Shared Reports workspace?

    Thanks,
    Frannie 

  • Unknown said:

    Our Finance department is interested in this sort of report. I can't find it in TASK for some reason - it's solution #32 in the Shared Reports workspace?

    Hi, Frannie--

    The utility that downloads Element data (including an SSRS report, iirc) is in solution #32 in "Version Upgrades and Patches"; it is an optional component.

    The report I referred to is a custom SSRS report that I made to replace a custom IM report we had used with Transcend and which our accounting folks were used to. I'd be happy to share it if it sounds interesting.

     

  • Hi Chris,

     

    We would also be interested in that report.

     

    Thanks,

    Bobby Moseley

    Houston Ballet

    601 Preston Street

    Houston, TX 77002

    (713) 535-3253

     

    From: Tessitura Technical Forum [mailto:forums-technical@tessituranetwork.com] On Behalf Of Chris Jensen
    Sent: Thursday, May 07, 2015 3:31 PM
    To: Moseley, Bobby
    Subject: RE: [Tessitura Technical Forum] Element Double charge

     

    Frances O'Connell:

    Our Finance department is interested in this sort of report. I can't find it in TASK for some reason - it's solution #32 in the Shared Reports workspace?

    Hi, Frannie--

    The utility that downloads Element data (including an SSRS report, iirc) is in solution #32 in "Version Upgrades and Patches"; it is an optional component.

    The report I referred to is a custom SSRS report that I made to replace a custom IM report we had used with Transcend and which our accounting folks were used to. I'd be happy to share it if it sounds interesting.

     

    From: Frances O'Connell <bounce-francesoconnell1133@tessituranetwork.com>
    Sent: 5/7/2015 3:54:21 PM

    Hi Chris,

    Our Finance department is interested in this sort of report. I can't find it in TASK for some reason - it's solution #32 in the Shared Reports workspace?

    Thanks,
    Frannie 




    This message was sent automatically to you by www.tessituranetwork.com because you subscribed to the Tessitura Technical Forum. You may reply to this message to post to the Technical forum or visit the site to search, read and post to the forums. In the interest of keeping the forum posts from becoming cluttered, we encourage you to delete previous message text from your reply before sending. Thank you!

  • The utility that downloads Element data (including an SSRS report, iirc) is in solution #32 in "Version Upgrades and Patches"; it is an optional component.

    The report I referred to is a custom SSRS report that I made to replace a custom IM report we had used with Transcend and which our accounting folks were used to. I'd be happy to share it if it sounds interesting.

     

    element_custom_report_chrisj_20140825.zip
  • Hi Chris,

    We would also be interested in that report, if you are sharing (we already have the Element utility installed).

     

    Thanks!

     

    Stacey Voigt

    Database Manager

    Santa Barbara Center

    for the Performing Arts

     

    svoigt@granadasb.org

    805-899-3000 x 128

     

     

     

    From: Tessitura Technical Forum [mailto:forums-technical@tessituranetwork.com] On Behalf Of Chris Jensen
    Sent: Thursday, May 07, 2015 1:30 PM
    To: Stacey Voigt
    Subject: RE: [Tessitura Technical Forum] Element Double charge

     

    Frances O'Connell:

    Our Finance department is interested in this sort of report. I can't find it in TASK for some reason - it's solution #32 in the Shared Reports workspace?

    Hi, Frannie--

    The utility that downloads Element data (including an SSRS report, iirc) is in solution #32 in "Version Upgrades and Patches"; it is an optional component.

    The report I referred to is a custom SSRS report that I made to replace a custom IM report we had used with Transcend and which our accounting folks were used to. I'd be happy to share it if it sounds interesting.

     

    From: Frances O'Connell <bounce-francesoconnell1133@tessituranetwork.com>
    Sent: 5/7/2015 3:54:21 PM

    Hi Chris,

    Our Finance department is interested in this sort of report. I can't find it in TASK for some reason - it's solution #32 in the Shared Reports workspace?

    Thanks,
    Frannie 




    This message was sent automatically to you by www.tessituranetwork.com because you subscribed to the Tessitura Technical Forum. You may reply to this message to post to the Technical forum or visit the site to search, read and post to the forums. In the interest of keeping the forum posts from becoming cluttered, we encourage you to delete previous message text from your reply before sending. Thank you!

  • Former Member
    Former Member $organization in reply to Stacey Voigt

    Has anyone found any clear answers to this problem?

  • Hi Gloria,

    No - although I mentioned it to some Network staff when they were on site this summer and they did suggest opening a ticket with TASK next time we saw it in our environment, so that they could investigate or speak with Element - so if it's happened for you, maybe try there!

    frannie

  • Former Member
    Former Member $organization in reply to Frances O'Connell

    Can someone in the network advise? Thank you!

  • Hi Gloria -

    I would definitely open up a TASK ticket if you are seeing double charges through Element and not through Tessitura. I would also note that there have been significant improvements and fixes to Element processing. Most of those fixes are all in the latest release, but you may want to also check that you have patched your system with any relevant hotfixes.

    - Heather